The evolution of loot systems across servers
I’ve noticed a few people on my feeds lately, frothing about Frozen Orb ninjas. The whole thing is actually really interesting to me.
The evolution of ninjas
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What I’ve started doing is just using a macro – as soon as I join the group, I click my macro: “Please roll need on the orbs so that everyone has a fair chance.”
The truth is, as long as everyone knows what the loot system in place is, and agrees to it, it’s fair. So no one really seems to mind much if we all roll need – as long as they know before hand.
Miss Medicina´s last blog ..Best of the Healing World: Feb 26th
On my server it was a case of everyone rolling need to start with, but as time went on, and there were a few long rants on the realm forums, the rest of the battlegroup changed.
Things like damaged necklaces or the inscription tomes are are still up in the air. I usually wait until one or two people have rolled and match their roll type. But I have seen a lot of people wait until everyone has greeded to roll need. Its not worth the hassle to even comment over these days.
The way I see it, you can’t really trust the people from other servers, so if you really want something, roll need. Otherwise you risk getting screwed over.
If everyone in the group rolls need, fine. If the first person to roll hits need, anyone who rolls greed afterwards is at fault for not paying attention.
If the first person rolls greed, and another 2-3 players roll greed, and some guy waits until other loot has been won before hitting Need and has obviously had time to notice that the others are greeding, they are a ninja… and they get added to ignore lists and loose out on a tank/healer they could possibly queue with, making their queue times that much longer.
It would be nice if Blizzard would incorporate a single roll option into items like this, where it is equally useful to everyone… like blocking out the need option, or blocking out the greed. Profession-specific items like books of glyph mastery could be made to block out need for everyone except someone with the appropriate level of profession skill in the related field, ie 425 Inscription. If they can give us all headaches by not allowing a holy pally to roll need on spellpower leather when the druid has no want of the gear (and watch it get sharded by someone else who hit disenchant), they can add this functionality!
I see the ooze part in the evolution of a Ninja BUT a murloc?! How dare you defame the noble gurgling people!
Tam´s last blog ..and whoops again
On my server/battle group….Greed was the norm and if you needed the item then you needed it. Frozen orbs was always greeded, but latley ive been coming to a situation where the tank “Needs” the orb, calling it a “Tanking fee” and leaves the group! WTH!!!!! That IMO is fubar, and me, being a healer, can go ahead and call it a “healer fee” SO latly ive been waiting till everyone presses greed before i procced to press greed myself because i am not going to become another person who gets the orb stolen from. Im a jewelcrafter and i use those orbs for my icy prisim, which could yeild me epic gems, or if not i get rare gems, which i could give to my alchmist to xmute epics. all in all this needing on the orbs is getting annoying and must be stopped. If only blizzard made it where recipies, orbs, necklaces & tombs were greed only so we all had a fair chance.
Delleyntar´s last blog ..Festergut down
Interesting. In my Vengeance (US) battlegroup, I’ve seen one Need roll, ever, and that guy apologized, we rerolled…and he still won the roll.
And I do pay attention–I win my share of orbs via greed. I expect at some point, Need will become more common (perhaps tomorrow?), but it hasn’t yet.
Kestrel´s last blog ..Weekly Word Count: February 26
lol @ The evolution of ninjas pic.
I care so little about the orbs that I don’t even look at the roll. IMHO, they’re just about useless. Even with a fresh 80 you’ll get better gear by farming heroics for emblems.
The whole need/greed issue is still so volatile.
I swear to god, if I see dvdat@zuluhed in any group capacity again, I will votekick him instantly. I’ve never met a bigger dbag on WOW.
Someone needs to write a blacklisting app and put it up on curse.
I have a macro about rolling need on them, as well. I spam it a couple times at the beginning of a run. Usually one or two people forget by the end, but at that point it’s their own fault for not paying attention.
“We will be rolling ~~NEED~~ on Frozen Orbs. Adjust your rolls accordingly.”
And if someone rolled greed who wasn’t a complete jackass during the run, I’ll usually let them roll for it anyways.
True, I love that evolution pic. Makes total sense that ninjas evolved from murlocs. lol.
I dunno, in hindsight it probably should have gone ooze > snake (critter) > snake (mob) > ninja.
I announce beforehand:
Need on Upgrades
DE everything else
Need on Frozen Orbs
I got sick of people waiting for 4 greeds before hitting Need, so I just tell everyone to Need, and failure to read = failure to get orb.
“And so the wheel turns…”
My god that last book was huge, I wonder if the the 2nd half will fit in one tome…
Bliz should really remove the Need/Greed/DE roll options for BoE items, and just offer a ‘roll’ button. Clearly it would make life better for things like orbs and tomes, but I think it’s ultimately the right choice for BoE blues and purples too. Sure, maybe that [Avool's Sword of Jin] is an upgrade for you — but I could sell it and buy the [Je'Tze's Bell] that’s an upgrade for me.
Miss Medicina’s way, announcing that all should roll NEED is the best way to handle Frozen Orbs.
This implies that you will roll NEED thus giving the other members fair warning. They will in turn roll NEED as well.
I usually announce this as well, at least when I’m tanking/party leader and there have been no complaints and everyone rolled NEED.
Last night I went into a group on an alt, did not announce ‘ROLL NEED’. At the end of the run someone rolled GREED, others (including me) follow suit. One person rolled NEED, got the orb and left group.
Live and learn.
thank you for posting this. as one of the frothers i freely admit I hadn’t thought about the standard being different on servers other than my own. time for an attitude adjustment on my part.
Like others, I have taken to hitting a macro (I usually do it right after the 2nd to last boss) that announces my intent to roll need. So far, it’s working fairly well.
Insightful as always Keeva, thanks!
my battlegroup greeds for the most part.
You can almost immediately tell who’s a ninja and who’s just used to needing stuff. You can tell by when and how they roll, if it’s immediate and without pause it’s usually not malicious, if they wait 30 seconds for everybody else to hit greed first they’re actively trying to ninja them.
I just wait till everybody else has hit need or greed and respond accordingly. If someone hits need I also hit need (rare), but if they all hit greed (sometimes reluctantly for some as they don’t “want” to get caught being a ninja) I hit greed and be done with it.
My battlegroup (Whirlwind) we always greed. And 99.99999999999999% of the time you can tell it’s purposeful orb ninjaing. I will usually wait a couple seconds and check if everyone is greeding to hit greed. And if they wait longer than me and still manage to “accidentally” Need I call BS.
I’ve had someone wait till RIGHT before the timer was about to expire before rolling need, and when I called him out on it say he thought “everyone was rolling need”
“Um, except that you were the LAST person to roll.”
…/drops group and disappears into the night
@Chimy:
There’s already a blacklisting app – all you need to do is ignore the person from the right-click menu when clicking on their name in a chatlog, or type “/ignore charactername-realmname” and the LFD tool will never group you with that person again.
So type “/ignore dvdat-zuluhed” and you’ll be good to go.
It’s a really awesome feature, best thing since stacking clams.
i’ve been passing on the orbs as i have no use for them. but hearing how you can use them to lotuses soon is changing my mind and i’ll roll on them in the future.
and i think this is why i prefer to run with guildies, no drama about loot.
In my group, everyone greeds. My particular server used to need BoE greens all the time… then when random dungeon groups went cross-server, Bonechewer found out that EVERYONE ELSE greeds. However, what happened next was interesting: Bonechewer conformed to everyone else, rather than the other way around. Now, everyone greeds. But I usually wait for one or two people to choose before I click need or greed.
Averna´s last blog ..Shout out!
I got tired of the drama and I made a macro.
/p I hate loot drama!! Roll **NEED** on the damned orb.
end of problem. I spam it just before the last boss on any of the toons I’m running a heroic on.
I think a better macro is “Do you guys want to GREED or NEED the orbs?”
It bugs me when people show up in a PUG and take it on themselves to announce how ‘we’ are going to handle rolls. They may be fine people just trying to avoid drama, but my first impression was a loudmouth jerk bossing me around.
Asking at the beginning accomplishes the same thing – getting people to handle the loot with similar expectations. And it lets the group decide if that’s Greed or Need.
Its not going to be a problem in the future, apparently in patch 3.3.3 it is going to force an automatic greed roll on the orbs.
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=12680047996&sid=1&pageNo=2#36