I’ll come right out and admit it – I am a 10man raider playing in a 25man guild. In Cataclysm there is a pretty good chance I will be a 10man raider within my guild – regardless of what our main raid nights are used for. If the guild continues to do 25s, I may participate, but I feel drawn to the 10man format, and feel that in Cataclysm there will be an abundance of 10man runs, so I will have plenty of opportunities to continue to slay dragons.

Graylo posted about equity in Cataclysm raiding, and the balance (or lack of balance) between 10s and 25s, going forward. He wants to know why 25s and 10s have to be equal, in terms of rewards, etc. He makes some great points, but I had to pull one of them out to respond to, because I disagree very strongly.

He basically states that anyone who says they prefer 10s but raids 25s for gear is not really telling the truth. I’ve seen other people make similar statements, and it kinda ties back into the idea that if you say you’re a 10 man raider but you do 25s on the side, you’re a bit of a cheater or a phony.

When I posted on this subject last April one of the common responses I got was “I enjoy 10mans more but I raid 25s for the better gear.” I find that statement to be nonsensical. Does this person truly prefer 10mans over 25mans? In my opinion they do not, and their actions prove it.

While this person may prefer the 10man size over the 25man size, their actions prove that they value the 25man gear more then they value the 10man size. So they are not being forced to participate in an activity that they don’t enjoy. If that was the case they would stop.


My rebuttal: It’s perfectly acceptable for someone to make that statement – that they prefer 10s but still do 25s for the gear. This is not nonsensical at all. What is nonsensical, or perhaps just extremely naïve, is the statement that if they don’t enjoy a particular raid, they would stop. History shows us that this is simply not how the game works (and this is what Blizzard is trying to fix).


Why I prefer 10s, but keep doing 25s

So why the heck do I do 25s, if I prefer 10s?

A few reasons. First and foremost, I love my guild, I love raiding with my guild, and they raid 25mans. They do 10s on the side, of course, but these are often late at night, or full, so 10man raiding is sporadic. I want to raid with them, so I raid 25s. I could leave and find a cozy little 10 man guild, but my buddies wouldn’t be in it, so I don’t want to.

Second, to kill dragons. Until a while ago, I was still very competitive and wanted to “win” on the realm progression ladder. Not so much, these days. And, once, I was hung up on the fact that 25man raiding was “real” raiding (unfortunately – this is not a jab at 10man raiders), and I didn’t want to settle for anything less than the pointy edge of the game. More and more, though, I wish I could just raid 10s for fun rather than 25s for progression.

Third, to improve my character. Inexorable was a 10man guild through TOC, and I really enjoyed it. But wearing 10man gear felt unfinished; it’s like still having a Heroism badge item in your gear, or an ilvl 200 crafted epic; it might do the job OK, but you won’t be happy until you replace it with something that is better.

Now, some (many) people improve their gear so that they can show it off on the bank steps, or compare themselves with others, compete on the Gearscore ladders, on the wow logs rankings, or to see if they can get a new crit Eviscerate record. I don’t. I improve my gear because I enjoy working towards the next step – whatever that is. If my boots are a tier under what’s available, then I want to upgrade them. If I’ve been stuck with the same offhand since Naxx, I want to upgrade it – not so I can kick ass on the meters or put my spellpower over 9000 – but because it’s the next thing on my list to “fix”. I won’t be happy until I’m wearing BiS gear, not because I want to be uber, but because I enjoy that process of continuous improvement – it’s what keeps me playing.

Obviously, increased numbers come with upgrades, so without trying, I am improving my numbers, getting bigger crits, pulling higher figures on the meters. But I don’t strive for gear for those purposes.

For many people, this is difficult or even impossible to understand. I’m sure some will think I’m flat out lying when I say I don’t do it for the numbers.

They believe that 10man raiders go do 25man raids because they want bigger numbers, or to epeen in higher levels of gear. Some do. I do not.


Stopping short of the finish line

Wearing 10 man gear when there is better equipment available made me feel like I was stopping short of the mark. It made me anxious. Better gear was out there – I could theoretically keep improving my character – but not in the 10man raids. I didn’t NEED the gear in order to continue running our 10man raids; I wanted it because I am not satisfied with “BiS (out of what is available in 10mans)”.

For 10man strict raiders, that list IS their BiS list. They’re not settling for second best – that is their BiS shopping list. They have a finite list of items to work towards, from the same content they are running as normal.

But non-strict 10man raiders are kinda stuck in limbo.. they could write down a BiS-from-10s list, but those “real” BiS items are still out there, available through PuGs or GKP runs.


I’m sure a lot of people wouldn’t be able to relate to this feeling, and would simply put it down to me wanting moar epix. But it’s not that. The idea of spending ages working on your character but still never quite being able to finish it off properly – well, to quote one of Graylo’s commenters, it just sucks.

As another commenter said – “When 25s have better gear, people feel obliged to raid 25s to get it, as “sticking to 10s” feels like an arbitrary stopping point.” I couldn’t have said it any better – arbitrary is exactly it. It feels like you’ve stopped short, stalled.


Nobody is forcing you to do something you dislike

Nobody is actually obliged to do raids that they don’t want to do. Gray’s argument is, “if you don’t like X, don’t do it” – ie, if you prefer 10s and don’t like 25s, stop doing 25s, silly. It’s logical. And it’s what many people want, too – we don’t want to grind instances because we feel obliged to.

But historically, that’s just not how it works. It would be nice if it did, but it doesn’t. At least not so far.

Look at TOC. Think about the thousands of people who ran four lockouts of TOC every week (more, if they did alt runs), loathing it, burning out on it, despising it. Wanting to punch Jaraxxus in his demonic happy place for never giving up the damn Solace. But they kept doing it, even when there was no challenge left, no more achievements, just a grind. Why? Why keep doing something that you hate so much? Gear, obviously.

At this point it probably sounds like I’m looping back and contradicting myself, agreeing with Graylo that gear is more important than my personal preference to run 10s. My point is basically that Gray (as I interpret it) is saying that my lust for epics keeps me going back to 25s, and if I truly disliked them, I would stop – but I don’t, because I want shinies (or numbers). This is an easy conclusion to make, because many people DO lust for epics and continue to run content solely for this reason.

But I can put my hand on my heart and say I prefer 10s but still want to do 25s because I’m not satisfied wearing second-place equipment. Not because I *need* better equipment to do my 10s, but because I will never be happy with gear that is simply adequate. My character can’t be “finished” if I settle for 10 man gear.

If a player chooses the 25man format for 13 extra itemization points then it is obvious that the raid size really isn’t that big of a deal.

If they still felt the need to do 25s for the improved gear then it is obvious that the raid size is really not that important to them.


The above statements tell me that Graylo doesn’t understand the mindset of many 10man raiders. Those 13 extra itemization points are not just about being uber, or doing more DPS, or looking cool. Those few points represent the final little step to finish off my character, to put the cherry on top of all my hard work. Not being able to reach that is incredibly frustrating, and in a game where personal progression plays a major part in most people’s gameplay, why wouldn’t it be? Why wouldn’t I feel short changed, settling for 10man gear when there’s 25man gear out there – regardless of whether I “need” it to play, or not? (again, stricters excepted!)


Analogylol

I have a lot of trouble playing alts that aren’t going to “go anywhere” in terms of end game. I can level an alchemy mule, I can level a herbalist/miner, because they will have a purpose. But I can’t level a character if I know I won’t play it at max level. I have to have a reason to continue to improve it, otherwise it’s just pointless busywork. I find myself dropping alts around 50-60 because I realise there’s no point in continuing to level them.

On the other hand, I consider my main, Keeva, to always be in a state of “not quite finished”, and I’m always keen to find the next piece of the puzzle to make her better. It’s what keeps me coming back – the next little goal on the list. And because I know she has a purpose, so far as end game is concerned, then I am happy to put in those hours to keep improving her.

Settling for 10man gear when I know there’s 25man gear out there – it’s like spending hours and hours on a 10,000 piece jigsaw puzzle, but before you get started, you already know that there are 5 pieces missing because your cat took them behind the fridge.

You can see them there, slightly out of reach. You could get them back, I guess, but it would mean moving the fridge, which is something that isn’t terribly easy, and you don’t want to do it.

But if you don’t go do it somehow, you’ll have to settle for a mostly-finished jigsaw puzzle with someone’s left leg missing. Is that good enough?

Are you happy to settle for a jigsaw puzzle is “pretty much” finished? Does it worry you that those pieces are still stuck behind the fridge, or do you consider the puzzle “done”?


Cataclysm: No more stopping short (gear wise)

Blizzard has recognised that people want to do a particular type of raid, but still feel obliged to do the other, in many cases. Graylo’s idea of having two completely different paths of progession, 10 and 25, and making people choose, is nice, but Blizzard knows it won’t work:

We sort of tried that, Gray, and they all chose 25 (meanwhile telling us that they wanted to play 10 but felt stupid for doing so since they were missing out on gear).


Exactly – we can do 10s, enjoy them, feel like we’re progressing and doing well, but there’s always that nagging feeling that we’re missing out on gear that is sitting right there in front of us. We still love 10s, but we feel obliged to reach out and grab the 25 gear if we possibly can. That doesn’t mean we’re lying to ourselves about what we want, or cheating, or being dumb for raiding something that we don’t really want to do. It just means we want to keep moving forward. This isn’t nonsensical, it’s the nature of the game – to continue to improve ourselves.

But in Cataclysm, raid lockouts will mean that 10 man raiders won’t be left feeling like their finish line is 30 yards back from the “real” one. While I have concerns about making 10 and 25man lockouts exclusive, that’s a post for another day. Gear wise, the fact that shared lockouts will never make me choose between sticking with Tier XYZ gear or pushing myself into 25s to get Tier XYZ.5 gear – that makes me very happy. I don’t really care if 25man raiders get more badges than me – I can get the same over time – but having access to the same gear drops out of the raid format that I prefer – I’m quite thrilled about that.

I will never again have to decide between my preferred raid size or being able to “finish” Keeva – something that many 10man raiders have had to do in the past – it’s BiS gear OR your favourite raid size, not both (25man raiders on the other hand don’t ever have to make that choice, they get access to their BiS by default).

Now I’ll be able to do both – raid 10s with close friends, while never feeling like I’m “settling” for runner-up equipment.


You guys can crawl around with the dust bunnies behind the fridge, I’m doing 10s in Cataclysm!



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